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Post by Deleted on Apr 11, 2024 21:44:35 GMT
Another small step forward for the 701 introduction. From 15/04 an existing 8 car class 450 diagram will be partly replaced by a 10 car class 701 service. Departure times are as follows:
Leaving Waterloo at 06:33, 09:03 & 11:33
Leaving Windsor at 07:53, 10:23 & 12:53
The previously mentioned temporary diagrams will no longer operate
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Post by T.R. on Apr 12, 2024 10:16:38 GMT
(And yet, not a word on crew training.)
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Post by twobellstogo on Apr 12, 2024 12:13:03 GMT
(And yet, not a word on crew training.) I doubt very much that 701s will get anywhere near my commute in 2024, and I have serious doubts about 2025 too.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 12, 2024 12:16:17 GMT
(And yet, not a word on crew training.) I doubt very much that 701s will get anywhere near my commute in 2024, and I have serious doubts about 2025 too. There may be a further setback as the 458/4s are set to be introduced on the Hounslow lines from June and drivers may or may not require a refresher/training course
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Post by gwiwer on Apr 13, 2024 20:10:33 GMT
I doubt very much that 701s will get anywhere near my commute in 2024, and I have serious doubts about 2025 too. There may be a further setback as the 458/4s are set to be introduced on the Hounslow lines from June and drivers may or may not require a refresher/training course That's a change of heart. Or a change of something by someone somewhere. The 4-car conversion program was to allow them to become "Portsmouth Express" units able to operate in 4, 8 or 12-car formations. The widom of that was always questioned since it would, among other things, introduce another small non-standard class into a large pool of standard and inter-operable Desiros (444/450) which can operate in any combination of up to 10 (444) or 12 (450) cars. Having a small class which could not work in multiple with those would introduce diagramming complexity, operational problems and potentially unreliability too. Not to mention the need to train all operational staff on a completely different type of train as no main line crews (other than a few who may have recently transferred) sign them. 458/4s were also said to be a replacement of sorts for the 442s and a concession to the vocal minority of Portsmouth line commuters who have always complained loudly about the inadequacies of the 450s for 90-minute journeys. Mostly the width of the seating, I gather. Given the very much educed number of people now commuting on that route since Covid - and the number was already falling in the year before that arrived - two bums across three seats is now a busy train if the full formation is offered. Releasing a few from the Windsor Lines will help minimise the number of short formations. They are at least familiar on the Hounslow Loop and therefore crews should at the most require only a short conversion course. Whether they will offer ample accommodation is another matter if 8-car trains replace 10-cars on a timetable still very much reduced from its pre-Covid level.
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Post by Busboy105 on Apr 20, 2024 9:33:55 GMT
Did Charles Holden design the Surbiton Station building?
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Post by southlondon413 on Apr 20, 2024 9:47:42 GMT
Did Charles Holden design the Surbiton Station building? No, a quick google search would have told you it was James Robb Scott.
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Post by BE37054 (quoll662) on Apr 20, 2024 19:43:56 GMT
Another small step forward for the 701 introduction. From 15/04 an existing 8 car class 450 diagram will be partly replaced by a 10 car class 701 service. Departure times are as follows: Leaving Waterloo at 06:33, 09:03 & 11:33 Leaving Windsor at 07:53, 10:23 & 12:53 The previously mentioned temporary diagrams will no longer operate I got the 12:53 from Windsor last week. Hadn't read this post so quite surprised to see one turn up. Nice to see them on actual services and in the early morning, not just the temporary ones, although I had been on one of those. Is it replaced by a 450 for the 14:03 Waterloo departure? This could also ease overcrowding on the 07:53 Windsor departure, being 10 car.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 20, 2024 20:12:36 GMT
Another small step forward for the 701 introduction. From 15/04 an existing 8 car class 450 diagram will be partly replaced by a 10 car class 701 service. Departure times are as follows: Leaving Waterloo at 06:33, 09:03 & 11:33 Leaving Windsor at 07:53, 10:23 & 12:53 The previously mentioned temporary diagrams will no longer operate I got the 12:53 from Windsor last week. Hadn't read this post so quite surprised to see one turn up. Nice to see them on actual services and in the early morning, not just the temporary ones, although I had been on one of those. Is it replaced by a 450 for the 14:03 Waterloo departure? This could also ease overcrowding on the 07:53 Windsor departure, being 10 car. Yes you are correct, a pair of 450s comes into Waterloo from a Reading service on 2C36 and takes over the 14:03 departure with 5C39 coming from the depot to cover the diagram 2C36 comes off.
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Post by buspete on May 11, 2024 11:18:59 GMT
Just wondering if anyone knows on the Waterloo - Exeter route, what stock they used before the 158?
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Post by Dstock7080 on May 11, 2024 11:51:26 GMT
Before 159s was usually class 47 (or 50) and hauled Mk2 coaches
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Post by buspete on May 11, 2024 21:50:38 GMT
Thanks was a kind of Intercity route in those days?
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Post by gwiwer on May 12, 2024 0:03:50 GMT
Thanks was a kind of Intercity route in those days? Not really. It hasn't had fast trains since around 1966 when most of the route west of Salisbury was singled and a lot of smaller stations were closed. At that time the traction went over from steam to diesel with most trains stopping at most stations west of Salisbury and some serving all stations west of Basingstoke. The basic timetable west of Salisbury dropped to a train every two hours and didn't meaningfully improve until a few more passing loops were installed. Tisbury helped break the long single line section from Wilton to Gillingham and allowed more trains to run as far as Yeovil Junction. Only the reinstatement of the second platform and a "dynamic loop" at Axminster has allowed the current hourly service to Exeter to be offered. BR Southern Region allowed it to be run down expecting it would close altogether; it was Network SouthEast who pulled it up by the bootstraps and started to return it to better times. Despite the SR considering it as a main line - and indeed it was the route of the Atlantic Coast Express and the Devon Belle - it has always been the slower route between London and Exeter by some margin and can be regarded as a secondary route today. If the WR route had kept stations open at as many places then the balance might have been more even but that line does not pass through many significant towns at all west of Newbury. There have been moves to reopen Somerton, Cullompton and perhaps one or two other stations but the WR route will remain the higher-speed main line.
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Post by buspete on May 12, 2024 0:42:35 GMT
Thanks for that.
I am an engineering manager in the rail transport industry not Network Rail though. I never understood what the cost benefit is/was for rationalisation of making double lines to single. A single line will get double the amount of rail wear as a single line as it has double the amount of traffic. With single line extra points has to be installed that needs to be maintained every 6 weeks and with more complexity in the signalling to accommodate the points, which increases the likelihood of a signal failure?
I was discussing this with a colleague the other week.
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Post by wirewiper on May 12, 2024 6:32:30 GMT
Thanks for that. I am an engineering manager in the rail transport industry not Network Rail though. I never understood what the cost benefit is/was for rationalisation of making double lines to single. A single line will get double the amount of rail wear as a single line as it has double the amount of traffic. With single line extra points has to be installed that needs to be maintained every 6 weeks and with more complexity in the signalling to accommodate the points, which increases the likelihood of a signal failure? I was discussing this with a colleague the other week. At the time a lot of the singling took place, track inspection was done by workers walking the track, visually inspecting pointwork, track joints (a lot track was jointed back then) and fishplates for cracking, loose clips etc. and performing running repairs. Every bit of track was inspected visually every 24 hours so it was a very labour-intensive process. Nowadays the track is better engineered and laid, and there are much more sophisticated ways of examining the track. Also back in those days the railways were in managed decline. Singling lesser-used lines brought real economies, but at the expense of operational constraints and inhibiting future growth (which was not anticipated on such lines back then). South Western Railway must curse its extensive single-line sections west of Salisbury. Even the eight miles between Moreton and Dorchester South, which was put in when the train service was just one an hour each way, can cause headaches.
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