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Post by evergreenadam on Mar 7, 2024 19:03:00 GMT
Even so, I think there would still be benefits of going ahead with the extension now, particularly to increase capacity via South Ealing. I also think the E1 should go a bit further than Osterley, maybe double running to the Tesco then continuing south to West Middlesex Hospital, or possibly somewhere further like Hounslow (via Osterley Station) or Richmond (via West Middlesex)? Considering the redevelopments still seem to be quite far off, I wonder why TFL awarded the E1's current contract at RATP on the basis of extending to Osterley? Or if RATP even would have bid for the E1 if they knew it would remain as Ealing-Greenford for the full contract, at least not out of AV. Maybe RATP didn't bid this time, or could even be the reason why they handed back the contract early (although they probably could have kept the E1 in its current form out of RP or V instead)? I think the trouble with further extending the E1 would be capacity - if it extended somewhere busy it might mean residents of the new estate might struggle to get on board their new bus service. I think Osterley is enough. I don’t think capacity would be an issue, it’s more about the E1 having to run right into the development site at the existing Tesco store to provide anything like the kind of public transport accessibility level that would be required with a development of that scale. And we know that TfL don’t like double runs.
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Post by evergreenadam on Mar 7, 2024 19:12:02 GMT
I think Hounslow and Ealing will likely be the main destinations from the redevelopment. Something like the E1 extension will be needed, as the E8 doesn't stop that close to the development - though I am unsure if there will be the demand for a high frequency DD route. I think Ealing Broadway is fine for an Elizabeth Line connection, certainly closer than Southall. And in terms of rail links generally, if anything the priority should be to reinstate a higher frequency on SWR services at Syon Lane Station to/from Waterloo. Would this be possible once all of the new 701s enter service? Ideally a more direct bus link to Hounslow should be looked into as well - compared to the current H28 service. I've suggested before that the 117 could divert up to terminate at Osterley, then send the 235 to West Middlesex, and introduce a new DD route covering Brentford-Hounslow. A local link between Osterley and Brentford would be useful too. Maybe amend the H28 somehow, or could even loop the 195 up to Osterley from Brentford (via Syon Lane Station) - this would also link Osterley to Boston Manor Station, Ealing Hospital and Southall, and stop close by to Hanwell Station. I agree with your point about SWR services from Syon Lane. A development of that size and the existing residents could do with a few extra stopping services at busier times. Call me cynical, but I think this E1 extension is no longer linked to solid demand. The developer is probably paying for a bus link to Ealing Broadway, hence the delay until 2027. Splashing “direct to Ealing Broadway in x minutes” sounds sexier on a marketing brochure than “Southall in 10 minutes”. Gotta sell those apartments hard to foreign investors… If Ealing is a major travel destination for residents of the new development, I still don’t see how extending the E1 is the best way to do that. Given the E1 extension isn’t happening until the first homes are ready indicates that the aforementioned role of supporting the 65 is no longer an objective. Also GSK are vacating the Brentford building, which further dampens demand. So why make the high frequency E1 contend with traffic on the A4 and disruption during Brentford games just to serve this development? IMHO linking the development with Ealing would be better done by a short extension of the E2. It would require a lower PVR increase and would actually create better links to serve Brentford, West Ealing, as well as the main Ealing Broadway shopping area. Whilst a bus service along Windmill Road might be a nice idea, Osterley doesn’t really look towards Southall. The residents of the new development (which won’t be cheap to buy a property in) are far more likely to look towards Ealing, Chiswick, Richmond, Brentford and Hounslow for shops and services and this is where the potential demand for bus travel will be. Secondly as others have stated the funding is coming from the developer’s contributions towards local infrastructure so the money primarily needs to be targeted at the needs of the future residents and mitigate the potential impact of extra demand on the local road network. I think only time will tell as to whether the E1 is the right solution. At the moment TfL seems to want to feed bus services into Crossrail but people in west London will only go so far out of their way to access a Crossrail station and in this case most new residents are likely to use SWR from Syon Lane or the Piccadilly Line.
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Post by evergreenadam on Mar 7, 2024 19:22:49 GMT
I think the trouble with further extending the E1 would be capacity - if it extended somewhere busy it might mean residents of the new estate might struggle to get on board their new bus service. I think Osterley is enough. If a link from Ealing to West Middlesex is needed, would an E2 extension perhaps work instead? The E2 is quite a high frequency route, so not cheap to extend. I think the stand space at West Middlesex Hospital is also limited unless you kick out another route - the 481 and H22 could certainly be rerouted elsewhere, (for example Osterley Tesco development site) given that very few people actually use them into the hospital grounds. An extension of the 195 from Brentford to West Middlesex Hospital could be an alternative and that would have the benefit of providing same stop interchange on High Street Brentford between both the 195/E8 on the Boston Manor Road corridor and the 235,237 and 267 on the London Road corridor. Now that Morrisons has relocated in Brentford the County Court terminus of the 195 does not serve any useful traffic destinations. Of course the E8 was originally proposed to serve West Middlesex Hospital on its way to Hounslow but that was killed off by resident objections in the side road between Twickenham Road and London Road. To be honest that was probably the right decision given the width of the road, double deckers would not have been a good fit. Plus I don’t think the E8 would have been particularly effective at relieving the 235 and 237 if it had a longer routeing via West Middlesex Hospital.
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Post by ADH45258 on Mar 7, 2024 19:49:27 GMT
So London United refurbished 12 ADHs for an extended route that wouldn’t have commenced during their contract tenure. The shambles that is TfL. It all depends on the level and quality of communication between RATP and TFL. If RATP were simply being optimistic about their chances to win the E1 and preparing early for the extension then that's obviously on them. But if TFL had assured them of a rough date for the extension that may have been the reason they bid in the first place then if I were RATP I would be very frustrated with TFL. Performance data on the E1 hasn't been great and I can't imagine it's made them much money at all. The E1's proposal was originally part of the Crossrail consultation, so RATP may have expected it to take place when Elizabeth Line services at Ealing started to run beyond Paddington? I'm surprised RATP never moved the E1 to another garage, once it was clear the extension wouldn't happen anytime soon. Running the E1 in its current form must surely be cheaper out of V or RP compared to Hounslow. Especially as V has the District Line for changeovers to/from Ealing Broadway, while PK/RP ran the nearby E11 for a long time.
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Post by COBO on Mar 8, 2024 0:12:50 GMT
I bet London United bid and won the E1 because they we’re hoping that the E1 would be extended to Osterley within the 5 years of that contract because when it goes to Osterley it would be closer to AV but now that the E1 will be extended to Osterley in 2027 it kind of like a waste in gaining it. No wonder they threw it back to the be tendered again 😂 man I would be peeed. I wonder if they’ll go after it again when the E1 is extended to Osterley in 2027.
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